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Long
before Garbage began a run of platinum-selling albums, Butch
Vig had already made quite a name for himself as a producer
and architect of the early 1990's alternative rock explosion,
thanks to his work on groundbreaking releases by Nirvana,
The Smashing Pumpkins, Sonic Youth, L7, Helmet, Soul Asylum
and Freedy Johnson.
In 1993,
Vig focused his energies on forming a new band with fellow
producers and multi-instrumentalists Duke Erikson and Steve
Marker. One day while the threesome was leisurely watching
MTV, they spotted a video of Shirley Manson singing with
her band, Angelfish. Right then and there they knew they
had found the perfect front person and artistic foil for
their upcoming project. Coaxing Manson to Vig's Smart Studios
in Madison, Wisconsin, the newly christened Garbage (an
"in joke" about the band's sound, according to Marker) began
work on their self-titled debut. On the strength of the
singles "Vow," "Stupid Girl," "Queer," and "Only Happy When
It Rains," Garbage became an international phenomenon via
a meld of electronica, Goth, dance, and classic pop. Though
Manson emerged as the celebrity, gracing magazine covers,
offering provocative interviews and starring in videos,
Garbage remained undaunted by fame and fortune.
Touring
non-stop around the world at festivals and arenas, Garbage
followed up with 2.0 in 1998, which solidified their status
as an alternative rock hit-making machine. Their new release,
Beautiful Garbage, rocketed to the top of the charts in
Europe, Asia, and North America. Recently, Vig took time
out from his hectic schedule to chat with regular StarPolish
writer contributor Tom Semioli about the band's work ethic,
surviving the current musical youth-quake, and what the
future holds for emerging artists.
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STARPOLISH: Debates over
song-writing credits and choice of material frequently causes
bands to implode despite talent, ambition, and success. How does
Garbage avoid this common pitfall?
VIG:
It's real simple. The day Shirley decided to work with Duke, Steve
and myself, we laid down the law: everything is going to be divided
equally among us, regardless of who brings in a song or who produces
a track. Bands always bicker over money, politics and egos --
I've seen it from both ends as a producer and a musician. Unless
your band is a dictatorship, this is a proven way to survive and
keep the music healthy. At any given time, one of us may have
more input, yet all our names go on the songs. We've always wanted
Garbage to be about the band as a whole, not individuals. Everybody
has to be on the same page. It takes humility and teamwork from
the start.
STARPOLISH: Home recording
has revolutionized the music industry. Should musicians develop
engineering skills?
VIG:
From a job point of view, it's a good idea. Life as a working
musician is not guaranteed, and the more you know, the longer
you'll survive in this business. From an artistic point of view,
every musician should know about the recording process; knowledge
is a powerful tool. If you're well versed when you enter a studio,
it makes the music go smoother, especially if you have a particular
vision of what you're attempting to achieve. By being cognizant
of the tools of recording, you allow yourself additional flexibility
-- plus you save yourself time and expenses, which you can invest
into other important aspects of your career such as promotion,
equipment, and rehearsal time.
STARPOLISH: What should
a new artist look for in a producer?
VIG:
I'm a firm believer in finding someone that will help you achieve
your personal goals, not someone who will impose his or her opinions
on what you should be or sound like. There are so many ways a
producer can approach a record. For example, pop artists like
*NSync or Britney hire outside producers, arrangers and songwriters
-- as a result, they have a very manufactured corporate sound
and image. Maybe some people can hear a "Butch Vig" sound -- I'm
not objective about it. When I was working with artists like the
Smashing Pumpkins or Nirvana, I felt that it was far more important
to capture their organic sound rather than force them to bend
to my personal taste. And those records had a tremendous impact
on pop music. My strongest piece of advice is to never allow a
producer to strip you of your identity.
STARPOLISH: A good producer
is a musicologist, psychologist and a cheerleader. How did you
get started?
VIG:
My career as a producer came out of my experience as an engineer.
I was always obsessed with sound. As a musician, I wanted the
tracks to feel right -- that's still the most important thing
to me. The rhythms, guitars and vocals all have to mesh. It's
up to the producer to make the call whether to push the song or
pull back. As I learned more about the techniques of recording,
I became more performance obsessed. I realized that performance
is all about psychology. Either a producer has to make the artist
feel comfortable, or kick them in the ass. I have to figure what
works with each artist. Though I still worry about sound and can
obsess over an arrangement, it's taken a back seat to ensuring
that I'm connecting with the artist. A producer has to get the
best possible performance out whomever they're working with.
STARPOLISH: Shirley writes
the lyrics and has the daunting task of presenting her ideas to
the rest of the band. This is a common plight of singers in a
band -- how does Garbage temper this process?
VIG:
Fortunately, we all share a certain sensibility. I'm amazed at
Shirley's lyrics; Steve, Duke and I totally relate to them. She
writes from a personal and voyeuristic perspective, and the content
of the songs is universal. The listener can interpret Shirley’s
lyrics in a number of different ways -- and that's a good thing
in a song. Just look at how the Beatles wrote lyrics. You don't
want to hit someone over the head and make the lyrics too literal.
She really embraces that, especially on our new record.
STARPOLISH: In your opinion,
how did Shirley hone her craft as a lyricist?
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"As long as the public likes your songs, you'll always have
a career." |
VIG:
Confidence is a big part of it. And practice, especially after
all the shows we've done. Shirley really blossomed on Beautiful
Garbage. That comes from experience. You can't do it over night
STARPOLISH: Did the band
ever sit down and try to knock out a hit?
VIG:
Not really. As fascinated as we are by what you can achieve in
a recording studio, all of us are really into crafting a song
with strong melodies and lyrics all the time. To us, each song
and each album is important. We never look at an album as a few
good songs and filler.
STARPOLISH: How did Shirley
overcome being the only girl in the band?
VIG:
When she first joined us she was intimidated. Steve, Duke and
I enjoyed a natural chemistry because we had worked together previously.
But in reality, we were terrified of her! She's feisty, emotional,
and opinionated. We're like oil and water. It's combustible at
points, but that's one of the reasons we sound different from
other bands. If you can capture the energy of conflict, it can
work to your advantage. The Who are a good example of that.
STARPOLISH: The new Garbage
record embraces a myriad of classic pop influences. Is it okay
for an artist to appropriate styles from other artists and genres?
VIG:
I've found that one of the things that turn people on is drawing
from the past while putting a different spin on the present. It's
okay to borrow influences, regardless [whether] it's a guitar
riff, drum beat or an electronic sample. When our band started,
people had preconceptions because of my past with Nirvana and
Sonic Youth. The media thought Garbage was going to be a noisy
grunge band. We blend lots of different musical styles and make
no bones about it. We're a guilty pleasure for a lot of people
because we write songs and hooks and make them obvious. We're
not trying to be trendy or blaze any new trails. And you don't
have to. As long as the public likes your songs, you'll always
have a career.
STARPOLISH: Did you study
music formally?
VIG:
I took piano lessons, and I played drums along to records when
I was a kid. Later on I studied music at the University of Wisconsin,
which is where I went to film school. I also enrolled in four
semesters of electronic music courses. Back then, I was working
with big old Moog and Arp synthesizers, which had no keyboards,
so I learned how to make sounds in unconventional ways. Any way
or anywhere you can accrue knowledge is important.
STARPOLISH: With the prevalence
of file swapping and downloading, are we seeing the death of the
album? If so, how will this affect new artists?
VIG:
Unfortunately, our culture is moving further into the "quick fix"
mode. Today, the music business is all about instant stardom.
Artists are enduring hard times having a career -- it's all about
the big single, chart position, and maxing out the money in the
shortest period of time. Kids who are young now are going to perceive
the culture in this manner when they grow older, and that will
affect how they approach music. I think the next generation is
going to be less inclined to buy an album of 12 songs when they
can just download a single cut. Their music library will consist
one hundred different songs by one hundred different artists.
Having no body of work for an audience to relate to is a dangerous
thing for any emerging artist, and I think it's going to be harder
for bands to find an audience in the future. The odds are getting
stacked against us.
STARPOLISH: Is building
an audience through live performances still the best way to beat
those odds?
VIG:
Yes - it's the only way, despite all the advances in technology;
touring and playing live still works. People will always love
seeing bands live, because it's a communal vibe. Watching a band
on television and experiencing them in the flesh are two totally
different experiences. We have a huge fan base because we play
live as much as we can. We always joked about becoming an international
band, and because we've dedicated ourselves to live performances,
it came true.
STARPOLISH: Why is it
important for emerging artists to play live as much as possible?
VIG:
When people see a new band or artist at an early time in their
career, they feel a special bond to them over the longer haul.
It's far different than when a new artist debuts on TV, which
everyone can access. If the audience loves your music live, they're
going to be there for you because they feel that they discovered
you. They may not stay forever, but they'll be responsive for
a much longer period of time. This is true in any genre of music.
And it's a proven fact for bands and artists throughout the history
of popular music in the last 50 or so years.
STARPOLISH: Any advice
for musicians just starting to hit the road?
VIG:
You can't have too much duct tape (laughs). Make sure your equipment
works, and that you know how to fix it. The most important thing
is to stay healthy --you can burn out real fast. When you're young,
part of the thrill is to sleep in the back of the van or to crash
on someone's floor and party all night long. But that type of
behavior will ultimately [hamper] your progress. Have fun, but
take care of your body.
STARPOLISH: How will the
current political climate in this country affect music?
VIG:
A lot of my friends are looking to music for comfort. For me,
it's been the music of Bob Dylan and U2, which really seems to
resonate in times like these. I've heard arguments that people
will be drawn to music that has human qualities and connects on
an emotional level. Then there's the opinion that people will
want to escape reality with vapid bubble-gum [music]. I guess
either side has a valid point, but I think music with substance
will prevail. That's what I look for in music.
STARPOLISH: In addition
to the music, Garbage's commercial success comes through your
videos and the group's unique image. What's the importance between
what people hear and what people see?
VIG:
A strong visual image is music is crucial -- it's the nature of
the beast. People want to see you, grab you and hear you, and
it's amazingly competitive out there. Even if the music is great,
you'll never establish yourself in this business as a performer
if the public cannot remember the way you look. We live in a world
that is visually oriented.
STARPOLISH: Should musicians
align themselves with people involved in film, theater, public
relations, and design to assist with image building?
VIG:
Absolutely. These days an audience will see the video before they
hear a song on the radio, and without promotion and marketing,
your music will fall through the cracks.
STARPOLISH: Garage is
comprised of older members -- how do you compete with younger
acts in a market acclimatized to youth?
VIG:
Shirley has a strong presence -- that's one of the big reasons
we've had tremendous success. She has a great voice, she looks
fantastic in photos and on stage... and she's a loose cannon.
She gives crazy interviews, but she's very honest. Trust me, there's
never a dull moment with Shirley. Unfortunately, with us being
older, it's hard to compete with good-looking 20-year-olds like
the Backstreet Boys. But our "odd look" works for us rather than
against us. We forge an intriguing image and we work hard on our
videos. Plus, we're all fascinated with film, which reaps big
benefits artistically and commercially.
STARPOLISH: What artists
are inspiring you right now?
VIG:
U2. I love their new record. I don't think they realized at the
time how relevant their new album would be. We did some shows
with them, and it is encouraging and inspiring to see a band that's
been around for 20 years sounding better than ever. Bono is like
a preacher -- he makes everyone in the arena feel like he is talking
directly to them. That's a rare gift, but it's also a goal that
every musician should aspire to.
STARPOLISH: From Dylan
to Rage Against The Machine, does music still have the power to
educate and introduce people to new ideas?
VIG:
Definitely. When someone writes a great song, the music has the
ability to take you out of the world that your in -- or put you
back in it. Music can be an escape, but it can open up your eyes
and liberate you and give you a sense of freedom. That's what
a great song can do.
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